If You Choose (or Are Forced) to Hide in the Shadows Your Voice Will Have No Impact


Updated on July 7th, 2013

I have a very long answer for the two anonymous comments that landed on my Spam folder, and which I marked with a red X. But I have errands to run and a revision that is due by the end of the day, so I can’t get to it right now. I would love for you, my Wicked Luvs, to have a go at it.

By the way, I emailed the below image to Nun, and she said, “Why do I always get the one-sided know-it-all nincompoops? He says he agrees with me, but can he read? I didn’t say any of the things he is saying. And, dear Bleeding Lamb, didn’t he notice that he just took Jesus from being a zombie and made him into the Frankenstein monster?”

I joined her mild burst of stoical laughter, and said, “Can I share your comment in a blog post?”

“Do,” Nun said, “whoever this person is he deserves what’s coming to him.”

Gracias, mi señorita.” I might have cackled. “This should be rather interesting.”

By the way, these are the posts the anonymous individual is referring to: Are You Nature Loving, Spiritually Inclined, Religious...? and Almighty Murderers, Holy Zombies, and the Cannibals Who Celebrate Them.

Please click on the image to read the comments.
Edited, in order to add the entire anonymous message...
...and to to include my response.

I had planned to go step-by-step and point out how Anonymous statements lacked validity, but let’s face it: a person without a face doesn’t really deserve that much of my time. Besides, my Wicked Darlings, you’ve done a magnificent job.

I will, however, say this: Anonymous, why have you assumed that Pagans want to “compete [with or] against” Christianity? Like many have suggested in the comments, neither Pagans nor Pagan organizations are trying to indoctrinate the world, run governments, or rage war against worldviews that disagree with their own.

On the “zombie” issue—yes Anonymous, the miracle of IP addresses have signaled at the fact that you’ve tried to make your wee little point twice—well, I would love to read the bit on the Bible about the new body. To be honest, until you mentioned it, and Kallan pointed out the bit about it being “a fundie Baptist doctrine from the late 1800’s,” I never heard of it. I’m always willing to read new literature; even made up ones, for fiction is one of my things.

Here is a bit of what I have read in the Christian mythology, of which you so clearly imply Pagans know nothing about (straight out of one of the thousands of interpretations that have oozed over the years):

Acts 3:15
“You killed the author of life, but God raised him from the dead. We are witnesses of this.”

Luke 24:6-7
He is not here; he has risen! Remember how he told you, while he was still with you in Galilee:  ‘The Son of Man must be delivered into the hands of sinful men, be crucified and on the third day be raised again.’”

Matthew 20:17-19
Now as Jesus was going up to Jerusalem, he took the twelve disciples aside and said to them, “We are going up to Jerusalem, and the Son of Man will be betrayed to the chief priests and the teachers of the law. They will condemn him to death and will turn him over to the Gentiles to be mocked and flogged and crucified. On the third day he will be raised to life!”

Romans 1:4-5
“And Jesus Christ our Lord was shown to be the Son of God when God powerfully raised him from the dead by means of the Holy Spirit. Through Christ, God has given us the privilege and authority to tell Gentiles everywhere what God has done for them, so that they will believe and obey him, bringing glory to his name.”

One last thing, I want to second Gina’s notion and agree with one of your points (even if I suspect that you don’t quite get it): It “‘boils down to believing in whatever they [Pagans] happen to like.’ Yep… unlike people of other faiths who regularly (not all) just believe in what they are told [to do], whether they like it or not.” I never saw any sense in staying in a relationship that felt abusive, stagnant and many times irrational. For that matter, I reject worldviews that claim to be the only ones. It makes no sense to me; regardless of how hard anyone tries, the rest of us are not just going to smile dumbly and disappear.  

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23 comments:

  1. Um....uh....er....What the bloody hell, Harry! According to Merriam-Webster's Dictionary:
    a capitalized : the rising of Christ from the dead
    b often capitalized : the rising again to life of all the human dead before the final judgment
    c : the state of one risen from the dead
    2
    : resurgence, revival
    3
    Christian Science : a spiritualization of thought : material belief that yields to spiritual understanding

    Nowhere in this definition does it say anything about a "new body". If Christ was given a "new body" how the hell would people have recognized him?
    Jesus in his "new body: "Hey, guys! It's me, Jesus!"
    Apostles: "Dude! That is so not funny. You don't look anything like him!"
    Jesus: "No, really! It's me! I got a resurrected so I got a new body!"
    Nope. Nuh-uh. No way. Forget it. WRONG!
    I'm curious about the Pagans you have met since the ones I know ALWAYS say the same thing when asked about their beliefs.
    Some DO still follow Gardner and his ideas have NOT been "thoroughly debunked". I am not a follower but there are plenty of people who are and I guarantee you that they can find just as much backup information (if not more) as you can criticism.
    Additionally, why in the HELL would I do "research" on Wikipedia? That is hardly a credible source. Any person who knows how to conduct research knows that Wikipedia should NEVER be used as a source. I could go onto the site you are referring to and change it right now, if I wanted to. The main thing Wikipedia is good for is a starting point for finding information.
    Finally, since you imply that you are so knowledgeable about Pagans, their beliefs, and how wrong most of them are, why are you posting anonymously?

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    1. Your reenactment of how people would have reacted to Jesus with a new body made me roar.

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  2. Anonymous's comments make me splutter in disbelief!

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    1. I does, doesn't it? I've been shaking my head a lot about this one. It is almost scary to see someone so sure of their unfounded convictions. Then again, he/she might not be as sure, if he/she was then the comment wouldn't have been anonymous.

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  3. My favorite part of all this is the "Zombie" stuff. So, I have just a couple of observations:

    1. Jonah (OT) and Lazarus (NT) are said to both foreshadow the "resurrection". Jonah was spat out whole from the belly of the fish, and Lazarus staggered out of his grave/cave, still bound in and trailing his funeral rags, Neither of these prototypes remotely indicates a "new body".

    2. In the NT - Jesus challenged a disbelieving Thomas to put his fingers into the wound in his (Jesus) side. Wouldn't you think a "new body" have been better repaired?

    Now, if we assume the Bible to be the irrefutable Source, (temporarily conceding this one, only for the sake of the argument) and if Anonymous can only make non-biblically-based points, then his/her assertions points are as dubious as the actual, historical existence of Jesus in the first place.

    And, I gotta tell you, the brain-eating affects of Christian theology, don't bode well for any "Jesus was not a Zombie" argument.

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    1. Some people go around believing that they can have their cake and eat it, too. Well, it doesn't work. Saying that a document is perfect, and then changing it (for what? to make it more perfect?) makes no sense. Either accept that it is a living mythology that changes with the men who follow it, or invent a time machine that can put you a couple of thousand years back.

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  4. Pagans (alleged) scattered belief systems is a bit rich coming from a follower of a religion whose Holy Book is known to be re-written, re-arranged, & politically motivated by those who wrote it.
    Wikipedia? Really? That is the best example the writer could come up with? & how is it even relevant to the argument.

    I think that the Zombie commentator needs to re-read their mythology.

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    1. I was rereading one of Kallan's old posts, in which she links an article where a politician speaks of laws violating the 10 Commandments, and my goodness, I couldn't stop shaking my head. It made me think of your comment...

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  5. "boils down to believing in whatever they happen to like".....Yep...unlike people of other faiths who regularly(not all) just believe in what they are told too, whether they like it or not. :D XXX

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    1. You tell it like it is, Sister of mine. The choices are too many for anyone to stay with something they hate.

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  6. I don't like to trash Xtians but as for believing what they happen to like, Anonymous needs to look in the phone book at the number of Protestant sects. Most are offshoots of a mainstream church because a few in the flock didn't like what they heard from the pulpit.

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    1. I'm with you, Francie. It is one of the reasons why I prefer referring to the person who made the comment instead of an entire group. I'm amazed how people forget about their own histories. How many Christians came to America running from someone who wanted to shove his religion down their throat? Just to turn around and do the same... sad.

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  7. You know, I could write volumes in response to both of these commenters. I'd like to point out that when Jesus arose, all of the graves in Jerusalem allegedly opened up and the dead walked among the living.. aka Zombies. There is no mention in the bible of them getting new bodies. In fact, there is no mention of it anywhere.. that's a fundie Baptist doctrine from the late 1800's. No new body was given to Jesus nor the people who came up out of the graves. Regardless, since there is no evidence that Jesus ever even existed as a human being, and that most of the mythology is some twist on older, Pagan concepts, it's a moot point.

    As for the other comment in regard to Paganism, I don't ascribe to anything by Gardner, as I find his assertions spurious at best, but I am not about to disparage anyone who follows that belief system, as those who do aren't harming anyone by it, and they certainly aren't legislating their beliefs into my secular government. I will state again for the record that Paganism is a large umbrella that is not mono-centric. We have no pope, no board, no bible to which we all adhere, so the argument that it is incoherent is ridiculous. If the commenter cannot fathom Paganism, that's his/her problem- not ours.

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    1. Live and let live, right? It might sound a bit 1960's, even too passive and cliché, but it works. How cool wouldn't it be if more people practiced it.

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  8. *Sexy Sister Sarah pats the silly commentators on the tippy top of their cute widdle heads. "Ya'll just slow down with all them thoughts now, ya hear? You're gonna hurt yourself, Dearie."

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    1. That's about as much response as I feel they're due. :-)

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    2. You, my Sexy Sister Sarah, made me grin. I always appreciate a good grin in the morning. You are right, Anonymous is a bit like a child who has only seen inside his house and believes it to be the greatest in the universe. So set is anonymous child in this believe, that when the universe shows him/her more, he/she just closes his/her eyes and screams, "My eyes are cover! You don't exist!"

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  9. I have never wanted to bitch someone as bad as I would like to bitch slap both of the Anonymous commentators... I wasn't aware that Paganism was in a dick measuring contest with Christianity.. The ridiculous is strong in those two and it isn't going to get them very far after this life ends for them... Thanks the Gods for the fact that we're intelligent enough to think for ourselves instead of succumbing to the vitriol that was obviously jammed down their throats.. Have they forgotten all of the knowledge that has been gained by studying the Ancients (Egyptian, Greek, Roman, etc.) who were well established in their polytheistic beliefs before the Zombie Jesus ever came into the scene? I guess they're just too busy burning things (and people) and rewriting their own nonsense to remember...

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    1. You know, there is so much conviction in this person's words, that I'm not sure if we should get angry or just feel sorry for him/her. Sometimes people just can't get out of the sad, misinformed hole that is their lives. Well, I guess they could try... then we can meet them halfway. If they stop throwing stones...

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  10. I have never read the bible! Too confusing for me! LOL! All those years of communion when I was younger. I guess I went with mom for the wine! LOL!
    I believe in, what I believe in and that makes me happy ;o) Simple and clear ;o)

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    1. The Bible is an interesting read--a bit gruesome and vicious at times, but some of its content explain the behavior of some of the horrible people we have to share the world with. It is a document of its time, and I think too many people have forgotten this detail.

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  11. Never read anything about Jesus being given a new body, geez I never realized he was actually a zombie Christ. But I mean after 3 days he wouldn't have looked like the modern zombie image we are all used to.

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